Adventist Media Response and Conversation

Tuesday, December 29, 2009

Lessons from Tim Jennings blog

I just read Tim Jennings blog and I wanted to point out the selective nature of people like Dr. Jennings. Their tendency to pull Ellen White quotes to make it appear she thought differently then the reality of what she wrote. He begin well by pointing out the idea that the Lesson study guide promotes as truth some rather nasty ideas about God. Here are some excerpts of his article.

Jesus - Angry Executioner or Baby of Bethlehem?

Friday, December 25 2009 11:25

Last weekend our class started the Lesson Guide for the New Year, The Fruit of the Spirit. I was so shocked by one paragraph from Thursday, December 31 that I had to blog about it. Here is the paragraph:

Between 1730 and 1745 the American colonies from Maine to Georgia experienced a religious revival known as the Great Awakening. Jonathan Edwards was a leader in this movement of spiritual renewal. In July of 1741 he preached a sermon entitled, “Sinners in the Hands of an Angry God,” which for some has become a symbol of the bleak, cruel, and hell-bent outlook of many Christians. However polemical, this sermon did express the truth about the awful weight of sin, the attitude of an infinitely holy God toward sin, and the surety of the day of judgment. [emphasis mine].

In case you are not familiar with the specific sermon cited above, here is an excerpt from Jonathan Edwards Sermon preached July 8, 1741:

[cut some of the Edward's quote]

It is everlasting wrath. It would be dreadful to suffer this fierceness and wrath of Almighty God one moment; but you must suffer it to all eternity. There will be no end to this exquisite horrible misery. When you look forward, you shall see a long for ever, a boundless duration before you, which will swallow up your thoughts, and amaze your soul; and you will absolutely despair of ever having any deliverance, any end, any mitigation, any rest at all. You will know certainly that you must wear out long ages, millions of millions of ages, in wrestling and conflicting with this almighty merciless vengeance; and then when you have so done, when so many ages have actually been spent by you in this manner, you will know that all is but a point to what remains. So that your punishment will indeed be infinite.

Do you find this sermon presents the “truth about the awful weight of sin, the attitude of an infinitely holy God toward sin, and the surety of a day of judgment”?

Let’s consider another Christian writer and speaker who came about 100 years after Jonathan Edwards. Below is Ellen White’s perspective on sin and God and judgment:

We are not to regard God as waiting to punish the sinner for his sin. The sinner brings the punishment upon himself. His own actions start a train of circumstances that bring the sure result. Every act of transgression reacts upon the sinner, works in him a change of character, and makes it more easy for him to transgress again. By choosing to sin, men separate themselves from God, cut themselves off from the channel of blessing, and the sure result is ruin and death. {1SM 235.2} [emphasis mine]

Does this sound like the same God that Jonathan Edwards was describing?

Jonathan Edwards describes a universe in which God is angry, wrathful, without mercy or pity and inflicts pain and immeasurable suffering upon His creatures. It is absolutely mind boggling that our Study Guide would quote such a grossly distorted representation of God as a “source of truth” about Him.

The Bible teaches that the wages of sin is death and sin, if unremedied results in death (Romans 6:23, James 1:15). But Jonathan Edwards describes an existence in which God is the source of death, the cause of suffering, the inflictor of torment. Nothing could be further from the truth. Satan is the father of lies and his primary lies are about God. If we believe Satan’s lies about God then we distrust God, fear Him and remain separated from Him.

While Jennings is correct in taking to task the lesson study guide he is in error with his use of Ellen White. Ellen White’s quote is not about end time judgment it is in fact talking about the consequences of sin in this life not in the Judgment after life which is what Edwards is talking about. Ellen White is writing about the 10 commandments. In context the Selected Messages quote says:

The law of ten commandments is not to be looked upon as much from the prohibitory side, as from the mercy side. Its prohibitions are the sure guarantee of happiness in obedience. As received in Christ, it works in us the purity of character that will bring joy to us through eternal ages. To the obedient it is a wall of protection. We behold in it the goodness of God, who by revealing to men the immutable principles of righteousness, seeks to shield them from the evils that result from transgression. {1SM 235.1}

We are not to regard God as waiting to punish the sinner for his sin. The sinner brings the punishment upon himself. His own actions start a train of circumstances that bring the sure result. Every act of transgression reacts upon the sinner, works in him a change of character, and makes it more easy for him to transgress again. By choosing to sin, men separate themselves from God, cut themselves off from the channel of blessing, and the sure result is ruin and death. {1SM 235.2}

The law is an expression of God's idea. When we receive it in Christ, it becomes our idea. It lifts us above the power of natural desires and tendencies, above temptations that lead to sin. "Great peace have they which love thy law: and nothing shall offend them" (Ps. 119: 165)-- cause them to stumble. {1SM 235.3}

There is no peace in unrighteousness; the wicked are at war with God. But he who receives the righteousness of the law in Christ is in harmony with heaven. "Mercy and truth are met together; righteousness and peace have kissed each other" (Ps. 85: 10).--Letter 96, 1896. {1SM 235.4}

To properly compare Ellen White to Edwards on the subject of torment after judgment Jennings should have used statements which address that subject.

Then I saw thrones, and Jesus and the redeemed saints sat upon them; and the saints reigned as kings [ 291 ] and priests unto God. Christ, in union with His people, judged the wicked dead, comparing their acts with the statute book, the Word of God, and deciding every case according to the deeds done in the body. Then they meted out to the wicked the portion which they must suffer, according to their works; and it was written against their names in the book of death. Satan also and his angels were judged by Jesus and the saints. Satan's punishment was to be far greater than that of those whom he had deceived. His suffering would so far exceed theirs as to bear no comparison with it. After all those whom he had deceived had perished, Satan was still to live and suffer on much longer. {Early Writings 290.3}

Satan rushes into the midst of his followers and tries to stir up the multitude to action. But fire from God out of heaven is rained upon them, and the great men, and mighty men, the noble, the poor and miserable, are all consumed together. I saw that some were quickly destroyed, while others suffered longer. They were punished according to the deeds done in the body. Some were many days consuming, and just as long as there was a portion of them unconsumed, all the sense of suffering remained. Said the angel, "The worm of life shall not die; their fire shall not be quenched as long as there is the least particle for it to prey upon." {Early Writings 294.1}

There is certainly still a considerable difference between Edwards and White here. A difference in duration of the torture but does either one of them present an intelligent view of God? Edwards make little sense with God tormenting people for all eternity, a truly miraculous event but to what purpose? Then Ellen White presents a view of a shortened torture but again for what purpose? I am going to hurt you and then kill you, will that teach you a lesson or will that act as simple revenge? It won’t teach a lesson because you are going to be dead and if God is in the business of revenge then saying He is love would be false.

4 comments:

Al said...

Some would argue EGW took steps in the right direction and that is what counts. She would have benefited from having a person like yourself there to get her to clarify her thoughts and denote whether they are her own musings or divenly inspired.

Shifting thoughts:
When Jesus comes we are changed, passing from death to life. But where do I get the idea that I'll get a perfected character as well. What would be wrong with finishing my character development in Heaven?

Ron Corson said...

So there could still be jerks in heaven? Interesting thought. I kind of think all that we need is the desire to allow God to change us. It is one of those things that would be nice to happen in a twinkling of an eye. Character perfection just like physical or mental perfection are likely not something that we can train ourselves into, at least here, can't say about heaven thought I have a difficult time speculating about heaven it is something I can't imagine. Maybe we will still be jerks growing and perfecting our characters but be way more tolerant and loving of jerks so it won't matter too much to us.

Anonymous said...

Maybe we need jerks around us IN ORDER to perfect our characters! ;-) (How would you learn patience, longsuffering, etc., without them?)

Anonymous said...

Jesus went to prepare a place for us...no eye has seen nor ear has heard... Heaven is all good! There will not be any sin in Heaven. We are not going to have to deal with pride, hate, etc... In a moment in a twinke of an eye we shall be changed. This sinful corruptable body shall be changed into one that can stand by God. We are all going to be so blown away by how awesome God is...we won't be looking at one another and dealing with "issues". We will be family as God wants us to be.

You know what? Down here we are all jerks at one time or another. Does our being a jerk help others to grow...sure, but does our being jerks hurt others too...sure again. I don't know...I don't want to be a jerk anymore. I thank God for never giving up on me. We need to have our eyes on Jesus, the author an finisher of our faith. We need to stand up for Jesus, we need to do it with love, but we need to stand!

I am an Adventist Christian. I am a Christian Adventist...I am a Christian! I am a follower of Jesus. I connect with my Adventist church beliefs. I see that they point well to an awesome, loving God.

People get all into trying to figure out how God destroys. Is God quite active and very much part of how the evil are done away with? Or is God passive? Does God rain down fire on the evil? Or does He simply turn away and let them go to their own desires? You know what...either way, God makes a real choice. If He turns away and lets them go...they are destroyed. If God rains down fire...they are destroyed. Either way it is God who judges what to do with them.

Adam and Eve were told to leave the garden...they didn't walk out on their own.

God is in control. He is all love, and love does judge. This whole "new" view point is so old it isn't even funny. The Bible is clear on it all. Read Chapters 41 and 42 (could be 42 & 43...you will know when you look : ) in GC. (The Controvercy Ended)

Study is good! God is good! All for His glory!

R